Well im lvl 39 feral druid and im askin should i switch to balance and lvl-up easy as on feral

Fellwynn: Druid of the Draka Server.

It can be.  It can also be a bit more difficult.  Certain Elementals are immune to our nature damage wich means the only way for us to do damage to them is with arcane magic; our Moonfire and Starfire.  It's not impossible it just takes longer and uses more mana.  I would point out too that that spec change also requires a gear change.  Your feral gear, ie, attack power and agility will not benefita balance druid who uses spell damage and intelect.

I suggest you build up the gear, respec and try it out.  It's not too expensive if you've never respec'd and you can only learn from the experiance.  I myself am balance and I thorouly enjoy it.

Good luck and happy questing.

Fellwynn

ok i would like to say things or 2 about it.
in low lvls u dont usually meet elements and if u do they are
probably air which immune to nature which make it harder.
but from my experince in my WHOLE play time the only time
i had meeting with elements is while farming :P.
<i quested in auberdine ahsenvale and so on>
balance is easyer to lvl for a few reasons u dont need
to atk meele u can cast in boomkin and elf.
and for 2 peoples quest u wont need anyone to help
cuz u got root and in 2 peoples quests they are not immune
to such cc.

i hope my answer is enough :P

balance actually has an easier time in solo PVE than feral, considerably so.  reason?  simple, moonkins can get their full armor bonus without the sacrifice in DPS that comes from shifting from cat to bear form.  moonkin form also has the highest dps, period, and an easier time healing than feral speced/geared druids.

MOONKIN CANNOT LVL FASTER THAN FERAL!!! i have a 70 druid and while i love moonkin i KNOW that feral is much better for lvling for a few good reasons...1: they do not require mana only to heal themselves after maybe 3-4 fights therefore less downtime 2: feral have a better time dealing with elites. i soloed alot of elites that required 2 ppl as feral and i knoww i couldnt if i was moonkin because they hit hard and where immune to root 3: (and this 1 is reeeeally important in higher lvls) u get invited to far more instances therefore completing instance quests faster which often give tons of experience as well as blue are. the reason is that ferals can tank as well as dps. if the group already has a tank well u can still dps in catform as well as support the healer with innervate and offtanking when the need arises. All moonkin can do is dps and maybe help heal but that requires shifting out of moonkin form making the aura go bye bye.  I dont know about any1 else's server but in my srver the 2 things i see ppl looking for are healers and tanks.  Feral seems to be the only "hybrid" of the 3 talent trees cause resto can only heal balance can only dps but feral can dps as well as tank withought using a bit of mana making it more practical for grinding as well as instances/raids hope that helps

u sr. are wrong. While balance does have more armor than cat form. cats have the stats to avoid more melee attacks..since your moonkin u will prob have +spell damage int sta and maybe some spirit which does nothing to increase your defences..what are the cats main stats? str agit and stamina and what does agility do? increase your DODGE thats right u dont need armor if u dont get hit.  i think agi also adds armor but doesnt really matter in cat. .ferals also get talents that help decrease the damage u take by increasing dodge, decreasing chance of being crit and increasing your stats.this is how my fights go as cat- pounce, feral fire then mangle then shred and maybe another shred if my omen of clarity activates. since we are talking about lvling after that i usually spam mangle until i get 5 for ferocious bite sometimes only 4 combo points if they are close to death and its usually over with me having most of my life if i dont then i could just shift out and heal and repeat i tried lvling moonkin style and whle it was fun it was also frustrating drinking for mana and for those of u who say (well thats because u didnt melee to get your mana back) well when u melee u take damage and while u get mana back u still have to shapeshift out and heal which makes the mana u gained go away.

Balnace CAN level better than feral. i have made both and its basically this simple : if  you know how to play balance, all your gear is specced for intellect and some (but not nearly as much, as a talent ability increases mana regenration by % of intlect) spirit, and of course stamina, but only get stamina either as an enchant or as something that has ONLY stam and intellect or stam, sprirt, and intellect, and if you have ALOT OF DRINK that is at the highest level you  can drink (like if your level 24, and u turn 25, Immediatley get at least 40 sweet nectar), then yes, i think u can level FASTER because ya u suck in dungeons but u just dps and outside stamina isnt needed as much because of roots, so  u can have a ton of intellect to consistently wrath and starfire

Fellwynn:  Balance Druid of the Draka server.

Bottom line, spend some gold to try out the different specs.  You will level faster with what YOU are good at playing...except Resto.  You just can't do the damage needed.

My experiance, once geared properly, when I switched from Feral to Balance was I lvl'd faster because I was better at the caster than mele'.  Some people are better at mele' than casting so they lvl faster with feral.

Leveling is a process no matter what spec you are.  It takes a little bit of time regardless.

Fellwynn.

All and all we can say it DOESNT level faster nor does it level ne quicker.
Im level 42 Tauren Dr00d right now, feral specced.
And it plays pretty well, i can easily outdamage most of my parties and tankin goes well too. And as said before, DPS can always be aranged, but ppl will ask for healers and Tanks. Roots sucks, u cant use them inside, but pound stuns the nme too. And if ur in a good party, one stun is all u need...

It doesnt matter what u play, u gather xp just as quickly... Its all about personal favorites. Ive played a warrior a lock and a druid. And with my dr00d i enjoy dpsing. Plus it has the benefits i can ress, heal and tank if necesary!
Druids dont have to be one certain class. Thats a dr00d for u, the power of droods lies in the fact u can do everything. U shudnt focus on one type like feral or balanced, u shud worry about using ur abilities to the fullest. A rogue can never heal, but a feral dr00d can still give back up heals

it aall depends what u prefer im 67 and feral right now and i only have to heal after every 6 kills when i was balance i had to heal more often cause u take more damage but i took enemzs down a bit faster and it takes longer cause u have to drink and u use alot of money for drinks if ur feral u dont have to drink cause everytime u lose mana u just use innervate and by the time that u have no mana agein innervate is ready again. i love feral but balance is awesome too so just pick wich one u like better

ok....i'm really confused because i was balanced but then i switched to feral(i'm not bothering with resto) and now people are saying balanced is better so what is better??

For levelling, it depends on your gameplay, like said above.

I personally enjoy Balance over Feral, as I'm more of a caster-type player.

Feral is good because you can either DPS(cat) or Tank(Bear).

Balance is good because you can either DPS(Moonkin) or Heal.

And don't forget, Force of Nature is a good way for Balance-Specc'd Healers to get rid of aggro.

As for Balance vs Feral in pvp, it can go either way. I have easily taken down Ferals who got the jump on me. Force of Nature > Moonfire > Insect Swarm > Barkskin > Starfire > Wrath-spam.

I have also been utterly defeated by Ferals who I hit first.

i need to know where to put my talent points i want to make my druid a healer please help
thanks

cmon dude, balance druids arent that bad, the moonkin form has some nice benefits, like the extra armor. they are basically casters with hi-def, and probably less damage dealing.

Just a slight modification.  You are 100% correct in saying that resto is by far the slowest of the builds for leveling.  However, it is also the easiest.  When i was soloing resto, yes it takes longer to put a mob down.  But i could fight higher level mobs, fight more mobs and what not then any other.  As we all know, when you quest you often don't get the fights you prefer.  Resto, i could easily handle whatever i got.

Wrong.  Balance is better than feral in pvp.  When you are feral, you are melee.  Meaning you actually have to HIT a hordie to do damage.  When you are balance you can stun, you can cyclone you can root.  You have several dots, which mean your foe takes damage even if he gets out of striking range.  And when you're feral, striking range is 5 yards.  Balance? 30+.  Let the idiot run around.  Cast away and pwn.

I've leveled 2 druids to 70, one feral tauren & one balance NE. I like their specs the way they are, just because to me the tauren seems a better feral druid, while NEs just seem more like casters. It all depends on your playstyle, & which one you have more fun with.

can't say that one lvls faster than the other and indeed both have their own individual strengths and weaknesses.

mostly i'd say that everything depends on your playing style. i for one don't like casters that much so i play feral but today i went into WSG and horde had 3 feral druids, alli had 4 moonkins...needless to say they kicked our asses... (we won the BG but the moonkins killed me at least 10 times...at lvl 49)

and another important issue...remember that if u like what u are doing time passes by faster...so don't go asking what is best just do what u like

the last dude is right,
whatever you like better you play better
i got a mage, and the thing i hate most are MB's
so i went feral, quick owning never need MB because you always use energy not mana
every mana brake cost half a minute
in that time i can kill 2 additional mobs so i think feral lvls better, but hé if you like casting go balance :)

Well, i am completely feral and i never plan to change, my only problem with the game is the players in it that think if it isn't a rogue, then it can't be in the dps slot in a group.

I understand Rogues are better at it, since thats all they can do, i would never, ever try or expect to replace a rogue in a group, i just would have liked to be given a chance to prove how good i can be.

Its just a pity i guess, players take the game WAY too seriously, this game is meant to be fun and entertaining, so, being forced into tanking or respecing into restoration spec to heal will REALLY make the game boring and pointless to play.

My brother and i have made a guild and we will be making a timetable for all members, so when we do instance runs, everyone will get a go, so no one is left out and no one is replaced by anyone else.

It is more better to enjoy yourself and all get wiped, then to be bored out of your mind and succeed in the instance.

You all know what i mean?

ive got a balance druid myself and ive found tht ive been getting more crits thea i did with feral.i relly hate tanking but i dont mind off tanking should the main tank go down but give me starfier anyday over tanking

Well, as this whole chain of posts has gone to show, Balance CAN level like Feral... depending on who's at the keyboard.


If you talk about Balance, then you'll obviously be talking about Moonkin (Mage) Form most of the time. We're basically casters with more armour (400% increase, comparable to Warriors and Paladins), a nifty aura (5% spell critical chance increase), and a slight boost in melee power (150% increase) and mana regeneration (chance on melee hit). We've also got lots of mage-like talents; Dreamstate <-> Mage Armour/Arcane Meditation, Omen of Clarity (for most) <-> Arcane Concentration, and all those passive talents which increase spell damage/critical hit chance/critical hit damage (Vengeance, Moonfury, Lunar Guidance etc). Our damage is all ranged magic, and while Moonkin form has not been named OOMkin for no reason, we still have damage which can come on par with a mage if geared well.

Balance Pros:
1) Attacks at range, gets less damage
2) 400% armor boost is the equivalent of Dire Bear form armour, and many Ferals tend to favour Cat form more while levelling. This is like 10x the armour of a mage, and 4x that of a Cat druid
3) Tremendous burst damage from Moonfire spamming, Ferals can only do this for a limited time (Mangle) till their rage/energy/combo points run out
4) Entangling Roots to keep enemy at range, and Nature's Grasp if they come near
5) Moonkins CAN melee too in a pinch

Balance Cons:
1) Moonkin = OOMkin ESPECIALLY when Moonfire spamming for burst damage
2) Has a high downtime (see point 1)
3) It really sucks to be OOM if you accidentally get adds


If you talk about Feral, there can only be our Cat or Dire Bear Forms. Most people accept that Cat (Rogue) is better for quick kills and DPS, while Dire Bear (Warrior) is for tanking, soloing bosses, soloing elites, and fighting multiple mobs. We have Leader of the Pack (5% critical hit chance increase, and self heals on proc), Heart of the Wild (20% more druid in all ways), Claw/Maul/Mangle (standard energy/rage attack), Feral Swiftness, and lots more passives (Ferocity, Furor (most), Predatory Strikes, Survival of the Fittest). We have lots and lots of melee power as Feral, but the main contention is that we have way way way less downtime than a Balance.

Feral Pros:
1) Low downtime. As an avid feral druid supporter, I do not carry ANY mana drinks or health drinks with me. Every 4 kills or so, I shift out, stare in amazement at my full mana bar, pop a Healing Touch (or Regrowth + Rejuvination combo if I want my health to stay tops after the next fight), and shift right back. (10 seconds max) This is nothing like Paladins and Shamans, because they use mana to attack AND heal. We just use it to heal.
2) High melee damage, and stealth too in cat. We dish it out on par with rogues.
3) We can deal damage while taking hits (Moonkins can avoid this by using talents like Celestial Focus and Control of Nature, and abilities like Barkskin)
4) We can stack up tremendous damage-over-time bleeds with skills like Rip, Rake and Lacerate, as compared to the Moonkin's burstier damage skills (Moonfire excepted, but it can't compare to Rip and Lacerate), but we can also do burst damage when required (Maim, Ferocious Bite)

Feral Cons:
1) Our armour is 25% that of a Moonkin when we go kitty, maybe slightly more because they might have some cloth items.
2) As melee attackers, we suffer more damage, full stop. I'm betting nobody will disagree with me when I say that there are many more melee mobs in the world than caster mobs, and Entangling Roots/Nature's Grasp is completely redundant with us. We also die more often, though this is highly debatable.
3) This is perhaps a minor point, but Balance gear is similar to Restoration gear (int, spi, spell damage/healing++), so, theoratically, Balance druids can heal better thatn Ferals. Certainly, Ferals have much less mana to play with.




So...
Balance: Burst damage, range magic BUT high downtime, frequent OOM
Feral: Burst damage, damage over time, low downtime BUT higher damage taken, less survivability, less mana


As most will find out, this boils down to personal liking. Levelling with a Balance can be frustrating sometimes when you look at your Feral counterparts. Downtime is a key component of levelling efficiency, leaving Balance at an obvious disadvantage. So what a Balance druid might try to do is to kill the mob faster than a Feral. This calls for a tremendous amount of gearing up, of spell damage++, of int, and of spi.


After typing all this, its getting late and I still have no conclusion, and I think I've wandered off topic. Could someone continue please?

I've lvl'd two characters to 70, both of them druids. The first was a balance druid, the other a feral. Leveling as a balance druid is certainly not difficult, you have exceptional armor and CC outside of dungeons, and you can achieve a lot of dmg very quickly. Unfortunately, you will need to drink to refill your mana every 2-3 fights, which can get time consuming. And if you run out of mana, you're out of luck. Also, in dungeons, no one wants a caster that can't CC and is basically built to crit so often that stealing aggro is almost a sure thing. Until you get to 70 and run raids where everyone is using omen, you will be pulling aggro of any tank you run with. Consequently you get invited to much fewer groups. Feral doesn't share any of these problems. Ferals are heartier for grinding, they can't run out of mana and they take hits much better. You have to heal yourself every 3-4 fights, but your mana will refill itself while you're grinding the next 3-4 guys. In dungeons we are exceptional tanks once you get to BC content. With newly lvl'd 70s a druid tank is much more effective than a warrior that just dinged. My balance druid, once he hit 70, was left to grind pvp gear and beg to be taken to raids  (and maybe even a 5 man), while my feral was asked to tank something every day, and is exalted with rep across the board. You do more damage as balance, but you have to decide if it's worth turning down the opportunity to be invincible.

See i have played many people and all i can say is that feral is more my style. It works well, and also if ur low hp, switch back, roots, and heal then change back to cat or bear. But balcance is long range and caster like, which isn't rly me. Also if they run u can easily change, roots, and catch them. Also if u were in bear form u have feral charge 2 and thats ranged. And leveling is easier because there is rly no reason for having to drink , but sometimes i like to go mageing, but feral is the best in my oppinion




FERAL FTW!!!!

I've read all the posts and I gotta say wow, there are some pretty bad misconceptions here about moonkins.

I have a 60 feral druid on the alliance side and decided one day to roll horde. I played as a feral druid until lvl 40 and decided to see "What the fuss was about". Here is what I have learend.

PVE
First of all, I am leveling MUCH faster as a moonkin than I ever did as a feral but it's not for the reasons many people think.

Solo battles in cat form consisted of prowling from target to target and pretty much followed the TF > pounce > shred x2 > claw x2 > FB. Depending on crits adding combo points, sometimes FB came earlier in the fight. Depending on who I was fighting, I could go 1 to 3 battles without healing.

The 'downtime' although non existant in the typical sense came from the amount of time it takes to wait around while enemies moved out of range of each other so that they could be pulled individually. This is especially true when fighting elites since everyone knows that it can be very hard to take down 2 elites in cat form. 1 no problem, 2 just run and save yourself the corpse run.

I hear a lot of people talking about how moonkins are always oom and I just don't see it. My balance druid is now lvl 46 with roughly 101 bonus dmg from items and about 3400 mana with just MotW and i only have 11% crit rate with aura. Battles follow this pattern, SF > SF > MF > IS > and melee. Yes I said melee. Mobs my level are usually at 50% by the time the reach me when I get no crits and the MF/IS combo usually doesn't get all ticks in before they're dead. remember that moonkins can also gain mana based on atk power when they melee and, on average, I proc about twice per fight for 52 mana. that extra 104 mana adds up. Oh, one important thing. USE LEATHER PEOPLE! after a battle I've lost about 15% of health and I'm at 75% - 80% mana.

Yes crits are vicious and at my lvl my SF crits for 930 (highest ever so far was 973). Also note that SF also has a 15% chance to stun the target. It's really pretty when both proc and a mob is dropped to 50% and then just stands there while you wind up a 2.5 sec cast of SF (talents are great).

This goes on about 5 or 6 battles (sometimes more if the crit gods are happy). This is also taking into account heals. At about 60% health I use my lvl 26 Healing touch to top me off. with my + gear it heals for ~650 -750. When I finally do go oom ...INNERVATE (without having to leave form mind you). I have low spirit so this only brings me up to about 80% mana. I keep going for another 4-5 mobs and then I Finally have to drink. by the time I'm oom again, my innervate is back.

Wow this is getting long but oh well, still gotta discuss pvp and instances.

PVP
I honestly haven't done much of it yet but I have yet to be beaten by a feral druid. Note that that at this level most will not have the furor resto talent to give themselves energy/rage so no instant charge ability. At this level, I'll beat a feral druid hands down no matter who gets the jump.

There’s really no such thing as a pattern for PVP because it’s so dynamic but a suggestion for when the druid gets the Pounce > shred > shred Jump on you,

Hibernate > Heal > Nature’s Grasp > SF > MF > IS> Barkskin > Wrath till dead. If they try to heal, wind up a SF and refresh MF/IS. If it becomes a battle of seeing who can outlast in mana you’ll win hands down.

Nature’s grasp is just another obstacle, and only really meant to force the feral to use up his mana.

Instances
Oomkin? No way. In instances, use your most efficient spells, this is SF and IS. So far, my experience has been that mages and healers drink a lot more than I do and I have CRAP spirit (I think somewhere around 80 at lvl 46).

Tip, Don't try to be the guy at the top of the dmg charts, be somewhere in between and remember that you're a druid. No matter how much dmg you can put out, a timely heal to your tank is much greater than any SF crit you can land.

hey guys there is one more thing u didnt mention.... u can still use bear and cat form even if ur balance... my tactick is usually to attack with balance (coz my low level druid is balance) and when my mana goes down i shapeshift to bear so they damage me less. while im im bear form my mana regenerates so i can take out maybe another mob in that form and then shift back into night elf and do the same. the point is that as balance u can still use bear and cat forms, while when feral u cant use moonkin :P
but as i saw previous posts and agreed with them, it all depends on ur style. my main is mage so i like casters, but anyone has his own choice.....
just wanted to mention that u can still use abilites even if ur not specced for it.

I don't understand why no one is mentioning resto... A good resto druid can basically grind anything his level and below. I once dueled a level 70 balance druid (he used feral forms) at level 60, and using only two of each of my three heals I won. We have the power to bring back alot of health cheaply, and most resto druids are competent. Simply because, in the earlier levels, most of the bad players switch to the undeniably easier specs. I am not stating that anyone here is bad, but you will find more crappy ferals than balance or resto.

I wanted to comment...just to comment. I have 2 druids (one is for my guild for 29 BGs and is feral...the other is to level to 70) My very first toon was the guild druid and put points all over...kinda sucked in groups..so i switched to full-on feral to tank (feral charge rocks at low levels) A few other toons later(twinked 49 hunter is my main), I finally went back to roll a new druid and made it all balance..with 2 points in furor from resto just in case i need a quick escape... i love it. Wrath/roots/faerie fire/insect swarm/wrath/wrath.... brings their health down over 60% and they havent even touched you yet. If I'm quick enough i can get another roots in and keep chipping health. Keep in mind though...this is more for PVE (and while outside unfortunately) At least it saves some money on armor repairs. Well...as others before have said...its all on how you play. I love the versatility of druids overall though. Enjoy your playtime.

I switched to balance at 32, back to feral at 34, then back to balance at 37....I just can never decide..augh.

But, as balance now, I can still go cat and dps a mob my level, no problem, so I can cast spells till OOM, then go cat for the next mob or two, then back to spells...not much downtime...and switch to bear when I need to.  I might try wearing some of my feral gear for some extra crit and AP for my kitty, and wear some balance gear for that extra casting power....of course, this is just while leveling.  I realize later on, I'll have to specialize.

I do have a rogue alt so I will probably stay caster with the drood and raise the rogue for a DPS only melee king.

Love the drood though...really love the "track humanoids" while in neutral territory...really helps from getting ganked too often.

balance<feral for lvling.  All your mana as feral is preserved to heal you when imp. leader of the pack isn't enough, and you can burst things down faster.

get to 30 or 40 feral then switch to balance so u have travel and moonkin form

balance can level just as fast as feral depending on what your killing. Some will be resistant to nature or arcane spells so feral will take them down more easily but then there are some which have a high dodge rate where balance will be best. Imo feral is better for leveling on a pvp server for the stealth and track humanoids when fighting in cat form, saved my life loads :)

in matters of downtime, feral has very little because you are not heavily mana dependent and u can innervate yourself and switch back to cat or bear and it fills your mana pool up. Moonkins are definitly mana dependant obviously and you will be drinking more....does this really matter? no, its the capabilities of the player that will level faster. However, if the same skilled and knowledged player where to roll both at the same time, i would believe that feral would be ahead at the same time played just because there is almost no downtime. But would it be significant? NO...stop being lazy and dumb and just level your char however you want to DONE

I had no problem whatsoever levelling as  balance Druid from 30, plus it's useful to stick with it if you plan on being Balance at 70... As you already have some gear before you start raiding for epics, and you have experience. As long as you pick the right gear and invest your talents effectively, you won't have much downtime, especially once you get Innervate and Dreamstate. :)

Been playing my Balance drood much better now that i have attained farily decent gear for my level (63) and i gotta say i dont fully agree with your post. yes.. feral druids can fill the role of a tank if needed and all classes can DPS... but... a Balance druid can fill possibly the most important (and usually hardest to find) role in an instance... the healer. I can heal fairly well any instance my level without changing my gear since i already have +spell damamge and +spell crit gear on and i also ha Force of Nature that helps in boss fights or those "whoops" moments when someone pulls too many and the healer (me) starts getting hit. So dont look down on balance droods in instances.

Simple as this:
  - No

Feral is, hands down, better than balance at leveling. Each side has good points but Feral still wins this debate.

I've leveled both a feral and a balance druid and here's what I have to say

BALANCE Pros
  - Amazing DPS.
  - 400% armor bonus without lack of damage
  - Treants!!!
  - At level 67 (current balance druid level) I had talents for +100% crit damage bonus and +10% starfire damage, I got 2600 or more damage with crits on same-level creatures, every time.
  - More Mana * Better MP5 = Better, more consistent heals.
  - Innervate = Full mana bar every 6 seconds, and if you're traveling around for quests that's a real short time

BALANCE Cons
  - Mana depletion EWWWW!
  - Shifting out of oomkin to heal gets rid of 400% armor bonus, which means dead druid.
  - Feral druids have 30% speed bonus in catform, oomkin's don't :(
    (I know what you're thinking, "Why not use travel form?"  well, because it drains mana, you may not realize it right away but if you use it every time you need to move it really hurts.)

----------------------------------------------

FERAL Pros
  - CATFORM. While in catform you're a rogue. The only setback to being a rogue in pvp is no self heals (except bandages and potions, which cost money and have downtimes) BUT! What's this? After about 3 fights when your health gets below 50% just switch out and heal, then switch back. You'd think mana gets low but it regens fast when you don't use it.
  - Bear. I got way more groups being able to tank than I did as an oomkin.
  - PvP! It's much more fun when you can pounce someone and rape them for 4 seconds (with [Brutal Impact] than it is to get popped by rogues as an oomkin.

FERAL Cons
  - Very bad ranged DPS, but who needs it when you can be a rogue?
  - No treants :(
  - To get the 400% armor bonus you need to be in bearform, which is only half as good as catform.



Edited to fix format